Ask the Sage: Quick Rules Questions volume 7 (DnD 5e)

[TADHG]

Originally Posted by Wynamoinen

A hard part of building and playing a multiclass warlock is keeping your warlock Pact Magic slots completely separate from the spell slots that come from ANY other class (which all have the "Spellcasting" ability, rather than "Pact Magic"). A 13/7 Bard/cleric would have 9th level spell slots but no 9th level spells known (p 164 & 165 of the PHB) since both classes have Spellcasting. A 13/7 warlock/cleric has the Pact Magic three 5th level slots, and the standard list of 7th level cleric spellcasting slots (4/3/3/1).

I've noticed people saying multiclass warlocks get ALL their spells back on a short rest, not just their warlock spells, but I didn't think that could possibly be right. This was good information for a multiclass warlock, but my multiclass option was with wizard for that sweet polymorph spell.

[Strange2099]

Originally Posted by TADHG

I've noticed people saying multiclass warlocks get ALL their spells back on a short rest, not just their warlock spells, but I didn't think that could possibly be right. This was good information for a multiclass warlock, but my multiclass option was with wizard for that sweet polymorph spell.

Just throwing this out there, but Polymorph is not restricted to just Wizards. As a 4th-level transmutation spell, it's available to Bards, Druids and even Sorcerers.

Of course, Druids can always Wildshape into a horse, without wasting magic slots (alternatively, just buy a bunch of scrolls if you're only multi-classing just to get access to 1 spell?)

[Retry]

You go off of the class mechanics. PHB p.165 describes how you are allowed to cast spells using either pact or spell slots from either class, but doesn't cover recovery of them - that is because it is covered in the individual class mechanics themselves.

So upon any rest you regain the slots provided by Pact Magic, while upon a long rest you regain all provided by Spellcasting. I can understand where the misunderstanding stems from since in Pact Magic for spell slots it states:

Originally Posted by pg.47 of 5e SRD

Spell Slots
The Warlock table shows how many spell slots you have. The table also shows what the level of those slots is; all of your spell slots are the same level. To cast one of your warlock spells of 1st level or higher, you must expend a spell slot. You regain all expended spell slots when you finish a short or long rest.
For example, when you are 5th level, you have two 3rd-level spell slots. To cast the 1st-level spell thunderwave, you must spend one of those slots, and you cast it as a 3rd-level spell.

People just hone in on that 'regain all expended spell slots' but neglect the very first sentence that states you are to use the warlock table for Pact Magic instead of the spellcasters table.

[Dystopian]

Okay, I have questions. Like... all the questions. :P

Let's just start with the basics... can you tell me briefly about what different methods there are for stat distribution and well, pretty much everything involving dice rolling, because I'm still very unfamiliar with it. I know how to roll dice on here a little

Dice Roll:

5d10kl3

1, 6, 2, 6, 7 (keeping 1,2,6)

Total = 9

but I have no idea what stat determines what throws and modifiers everything has or even how you get stats most of the time.
I'm finding the concept of maintaining my own character sheet a bit daunting because I think I'll screw stuff up.

Here's the one character I've made so far, which I'll use for my first campaign, but I don't have any idea about the saving throws, modifiers, proficiency (who determines what my char is proficient at and what the effects are???). Please take a look and tell me what you think/what I should change.
The base stats are rolled in accordance with the campaign's instructions (roll 6x 4d6kh3, one free reroll and one reroll for a one)
Scyrath the Poet

Anything you can do to fill the gaps in my knowledge would be greatly appreciated.

[Wynamoinen]

There's a lot of stuff there, so I won't hit all your points. But I can try and start.

I'm not sure what you mean by "what determines what throws". Most die rolls where you're trying to succeed at something are 1d20+modifiers. Weapon and spell damage is whatever the description states. The RPGX character sheet actually says which abilities effect which skills (eg Arcana has "INT" listed next to it). Most melee weapon attacks use Strength modifiers. Most ranged weapon attacks key off Dexterity modifiers. Many spell attacks use your spellcasting ability (which for Bards is Charisma)

There are a bunch of ways to determine stats. The easiest, most common, and (arguably) fairest is "the standard array". You just take the list 15,14,13,12,10 and 8, and place those numbers in the abilities where you want them to do (eg, Cleric would want the 15 in WIS, Fighter would want it in STR or maybe DEX. The Cleric might put the 8 in INT while the fighter puts it in CHA. Again, it's as you please.) A more complicated version of this system is called "point buy" (where you can adjust the scores up and down at a cost).

The saving throws that you're proficient in come from your class. The sheet you linked has ability score modifiers entered correctly in the saving throw lines. If you're a Bard, look in the right column of page 52 of the PHB. Under "class features", there is a "proficiencies" category. Under that, it says Bards are proficient in Dexterity and Charisma saves. So on your character sheet, click the box next to Dexterity and charisma saves. Your proficiency bonus (+2 at first level) will automatically get added in.

Your skills come from two places: your class and your Background. The class ones are listed right under your saving throw proficiencies. Bards are skill monkeys, and so can just pick any three. Just pick three, and check the box in the skill section of your character sheet. The Quick Build (at the top of the second column of that same page) suggests you pick the Entertainer background. But you can pick any one. The backgrounds start on page 125 of the PHB. Entertainer (p 130) for example gives you proficiency in Acrobatics and Performance.

[Retry]

Originally Posted by Dystopian

Let's just start with the basics... can you tell me briefly about what different methods there are for stat distribution

There are three main methods:

• (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8)
  Standard Array is a set array of scores that will give you 1-2 good stats and one 'eh' stat.
  
  I most recommend this for newer players as it's fast to pick and go. It also gives you one 'bad' stat so that you can learn how to deal with your character's weaknesses mechanically.Standard Array
• This allows for a more customized stat array where you can exchange 'points' for higher stats.
  
  You are granted 27 points to buy stats with the max stat allowed for any given attribute prior to racial bonus being 15.
  
  Here is how the point costs look:
  

  Score	Cost
  8	0
  9	1
  10	2
  11	3
  12	4
  13	5
  14	7
  15	9

  This tends to be the more popular array that I've seen used here on the crossing.27pt buy
• and of course, This one tends to be a gamble, but everyone loves it because its what we expect when playing rpgs.
  
  There are many methods, the most common is "roll 4 six-sided die and drop the lowest" (4d6kh3 or 'rstat2').
  
  Everyone likes it, until they roll complete and utter garbage and their character deemed unplayable. Many DMs will allow you to default to Standard Array if you roll poorly enough.rolling

As for what affects what, each stat is responsible for a certain skill. With every even number you reach going up the modifier for that stat will increase by 1. With every odd number you hit going down, the stat will go down.
10 and 11 are where the stat is considered leveled (+0). So if you go down to 9, that modifier is now -1. Vice versa, if you go up to 12 it is now +1.

What each stat affects is listed out in the System Reference Document (SRD) starting on page 79.


Dont worry about screwing up, that is part of learning the game! The great thing about pbp is you can take your sweet time in between turns or when forming a character to make sure they meet what you want them to do.

I would recommend checking out the 5e character creation guide here on the site to cross-reference your character sheet with to see what areas you can fill in.

If you have any further questions, please feel free to shoot me a PM. Helping folks learn 5e is what I like to do

[jj_wolven]

Originally Posted by Dystopian

Okay, I have questions. Like... all the questions. :P

Have you considered NPSG (New Player Solo Game)?
It is a program we have that is designed for new players to take them through all the steps from creation to a game run so they can learn one on one.

I can't find the link right now, so I'd appreciate if someone could help with that.

-me

[Imveros]

Originally Posted by jj_wolven

I can't find the link right now, so I'd appreciate if someone could help with that.

-me

Don't worry JJ, Dystopian is a few steps ahead of the game and already on the wait list. He's is just waiting for his Mentor/GM to be assigned to him

[Dystopian]

Since it's almost 1 AM here, it's about time for me to call it a night and turn in, but I want to thank everyone who replied to my posts. Even flung a bit of rpxp to some of the most helpful ones.
Retry is already helping me with a solo game, although work on the character there has barely begun.
I have another character I need to get done within the next day or so as well to meet a join deadline, so I should get crackalacking.
Cheers again folks. You're awesome.

[TADHG]

I want to present this here, as well. The two answers I've mostly gotten are NO...and "up to the DM".

I'm getting ready to play Curse of Strahd. We've had session zero, and that's it so far, but I talked to the DM about my concept and he's onboard with it so far.

I'm playing a warlock, and my concept was that perhaps liches and vampires can give warlocks power. So, Strahd is actually my character's patron, but he doesn't know it. Everything has played out in the character's mind. (Which is why I won't be going Pact of the Tome, though it fits my background a little better.) I'm playing it as part of the pact is that my patron is also my master, and I have to obey his commands. At some point, it is going to dawn on the character who is patron is, and he's going to reject him. The way I phrased it, is that he's going to TRY to break his pact, get free of his patron, who is going to be very controlling.

When I mentioned that I thought he would lose his warlock powers as part of that deal, breaking his pact and link with Strahd, I got the aforementioned answers. (and a couple of Yes, that seems reasonable). It's okay, because I'm already considered a multiclass into paladin, with an oath of vengeance or redemption, ending the warlock path pretty much at level 8. For RP sake, I'm not going to stop using warlock spells, and start using paladin spells, until a critical point in the game, when the reveal will surprise the rest of the party. (Why level 8? I need that second ASI before I can multiclass, my STR is too low otherwise.)

I just want to put this out here, and see what you all have to say about it.

[Retry]

Just to make sure I'm actually understanding the question being asked, you're inquiring:
"If my warlock breaks their pact, do they lose their powers?"

No. Generally powers granted by patrons aren't something they can take back.
This is why its such a risky ordeal for them. That being said - Patrons are not dull-minded individuals and know folks will try and break away and run now that they can see through the darkness and shoot eldritch energy out of their hands. They will typically have means of punishing/routing such "selfish cretins" who would sully their contract.

It would be on you and your DM to discuss what the pact was about, how it was constructed, and what consequences might your character face for breaking it. Outside of "Strahd is going to kill me!" - what else? Do you lose access to an eye? Do you gain an indefinite madness? Pacts with a Fiend often require you relinquishing your soul, thus sundering the pact is forfeiting it immediately. I am unsure how a pact with a Lich or Vampire would go, but again - something to discuss though.

[Astra]

Originally Posted by Retry

Just to make sure I'm actually understanding the question being asked, you're inquiring:
"If my warlock breaks their pact, do they lose their powers?"

No. Generally powers granted by patrons aren't something they can take back.
This is why its such a risky ordeal for them. That being said - Patrons are not dull-minded individuals and know folks will try and break away and run now that they can see through the darkness and shoot eldritch energy out of their hands. They will typically have means of punishing/routing such "selfish cretins" who would sully their contract.

It would be on you and your DM to discuss what the pact was about, how it was constructed, and what consequences might your character face for breaking it. Outside of "Strahd is going to kill me!" - what else? Do you lose access to an eye? Do you gain an indefinite madness? Pacts with a Fiend often require you relinquishing your soul, thus sundering the pact is forfeiting it immediately. I am unsure how a pact with a Lich or Vampire would go, but again - something to discuss though.

Concur.

First of all, a pure RAW reading of the rules would reveal that only the Paladin has a mechanism by which they can "lose" their powers—the oathbreaker mechanism. There is no RAW manner for a warlock to lose their powers.

Additionally, I would say it's totally dependent on the specifics of the pact. A devil might stipulate in the contract that the powers are only granted for the duration of the warlock's service. Strahd's Lawful but he's not a devil, so unless you as the player want to lose your powers there's no reason you have to, in my humble opinion.

Finally, here's a tweet from Crawford that appears to confirm this. Note that he says "the warlock has this power": https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/...78854119460866

[TADHG]

My thinking is that it's a pact, a contract. You get the power, as long as you work for me. If you defy me, refuse my orders, you break the pact that gives you the power. You didn't hold up your end of the bargain. That's why I thought that.

The other place I asked about this mentioned the tweet from Crawford as well. But a lot of folks said that it might be up to the DM. I don't mind losing the powers, if that's what happened, because I have a contingency plan for that. It's why I'm considering multiclassing after 8th level, into paladin. Probably oath of vengeance, though I am also considering oath of redemption.

I'm only hoping it adds to the story, which is why I would be hiding the features of the other class until a critical juncture.

[Wynamoinen]

"It's up to the GM" is just literally always true. It says that right on the first page of the Dungeon Master's Guide - '...the rules aren't in charge. You're the DM, you're in charge.'

I'd interpret the last two points as saying there's no basis in the rules for taking away warlock abilities. That means that if a DM just does that to a player without any warning, lots of players will be upset. It's a bad thing to do to a player out of nowhere in many circumstances. With coordination and prior arrangement between player and DM (and possibly other players at the table, if they are impacted by this turn of events), basically anything goes. But it won't be based in D&D rules. If everyone is fine with that, then often it can be fine.

[Numen Wraith]

 

If you watch Critical Role Campaign 2, Fjord goes through a very similar scenario to what you're talking about. He abandons his patron and becomes a Paladin of the Wildmother. Matt Mercer took away Fjord's abilities and made a power struggle play out between Fjord and his patron. He was essentially without abilities until he devoted himself to the Wildmother, at which point she reinstated what had been lost.

I don't know if it'd have the same impact if you knew the consequences of your actions going in, but it was a great storyline and I liked the way it played out.