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  #61  
Old Dec 11th, 2021, 05:09 PM
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This might be helpful: 6e Runner creation tool

You'll want the 6.23 file, ignore the 5.27, that's 5 Ed

Last edited by Arialles; Dec 11th, 2021 at 05:12 PM.
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  #62  
Old Dec 11th, 2021, 10:18 PM
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Hiya's :))
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  #63  
Old Dec 12th, 2021, 10:58 PM
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Quick question...
I'm building a character on paper, it helps me learn, and have choosen Human as my priority D. There is a (4) next to it, can these points be used only for the edge attribute as a human?

Thinking about playing a Rigger.
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  #64  
Old Dec 12th, 2021, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BionicEwok View Post
Quick question...
I'm building a character on paper, it helps me learn, and have choosen Human as my priority D. There is a (4) next to it, can these points be used only for the edge attribute as a human?

Thinking about playing a Rigger.
Edge or magic
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  #65  
Old Dec 13th, 2021, 03:14 AM
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Edge or magic
Or as a possible house rule ‘any attribute’ provided the attribute maximums aren’t adjusted and still only 1 stat at max… might add to the appeal of humans (mechanically there’s no reason to play one as RAW, although there are plenty of RP reasons!)
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  #66  
Old Dec 13th, 2021, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arialles View Post
Or as a possible house rule ‘any attribute’ provided the attribute maximums aren’t adjusted and still only 1 stat at max… might add to the appeal of humans (mechanically there’s no reason to play one as RAW, although there are plenty of RP reasons!)
I can live with that. I will update the house rules to include that.

Speaking of house rules, with the discussion of the updated print of the rules, I noticed that some were hoping that strength would add to damage of melee attacks instead of just adding to the attack value used for calculating bonus edge. Would we want a house rule making this so?
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  #67  
Old Dec 13th, 2021, 03:03 PM
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Have to be careful with this one… trolls could easily end up doing significantly more damage than an assault cannon!! Maybe add str/3 round down, so str 4 would be the first to have an impact. Possibly even str/4. Massive melee damage should remain the province of the adept in my opinion

Once agreed I can add it in to the excel generator as a house rule

Last edited by Arialles; Dec 13th, 2021 at 03:04 PM.
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  #68  
Old Dec 13th, 2021, 09:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arialles View Post
Or as a possible house rule ‘any attribute’ provided the attribute maximums aren’t adjusted and still only 1 stat at max… might add to the appeal of humans (mechanically there’s no reason to play one as RAW, although there are plenty of RP reasons!)

I'm going build a human character and just see how he looks in the end, I want to have a strong role play character but also want to be a contributing member to the team. Not that guy that bleeds out in the corner all the time.
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  #69  
Old Dec 14th, 2021, 08:52 AM
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I tend to play human characters as well. The only real downside is the normal vision, which can easily be worked around with technology. And while other races can have higher stats with some physical or mental attributes, humans are the only one that can increase edge. And give that so much is centered around edge, I feel that benefit gets overlooked.

Saying that, I agree that making a house rule that humans can use the adjustment points to increase any stat, mostly because if you are not playing a mundane human and make the meta type priority C, you wouldn't have anywhere to spend some of your adjustment points. But since all the other races have two attributes they can raise, I think I am going to word the house rule to allow a human to pick any one other attribute they can spend adjustment points on.

In short, I see humans as a very viable race (meta type). Not to mention that the world is still has the majority of its population as human.


UPDATE: House Rules have been updated with: Humans can select any one other attribute to spend their bonus adjustment points on from the meta type priority.

I did not add a new house rule for melee getting a bonus form strength. The topic is still open for discussion if anyone wants to champion for it.

Last edited by Kenjitsu; Dec 14th, 2021 at 08:56 AM.
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  #70  
Old Dec 14th, 2021, 04:56 PM
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Hi Kenjitsu, Everyone;

This isn't my game and I am currently not one of the players but if no one objects would any of you mind if I added my two cents about strength and damage?

I've been lurking, following the development of this game since I spotted it awhile ago and have been considering submitting a character proposal if Kenjitsu opens it up for the public in the new year.
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  #71  
Old Dec 14th, 2021, 05:52 PM
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You are more than welcome to throw in your two cents on the subject.

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  #72  
Old Dec 14th, 2021, 09:55 PM
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RAW there is a damage to soak ratio issue as they kept the basics of net hits adding to damage while removing armor's ability to soak. In my experience even with the Edge mechanics that can lead to some really quick TPKs even with the base damage being halved roughly on average.

In 5e, Strength used to be the base for all close combat attacks modified by a value given by the melee weapon. 6e ditched that harshly and assigned a static value which was one of the most controversial decisions which helped fuel the backlash seen against the edition.

There is no easy formula to use to balance out a change to add in strength as a modification especially when one has melee weapons approaching the damage range of HMGs before strength is even added.

It has been suggested to use the one-third approach which on the surface would seem to be a good idea. After all 5e used it for recoil compensation as an optional rule. But even there, you begin to approach better damage with a melee weapon than a Panther Assault cannon for base damage on an unarmed attack by a really strong opponent. With melee weapons you surpass it. You want to avoid this as it leads to an attrition-compensation battle that can easily kill off a team with a few good rolls.

The first few times I demo'd 6e, I had to fudge the dice because I rolled really well and the players rolled poorly. Even with an average roll though I would have killed the team.

So my suggestion since the rough rule of damage in 6e was to halve take that one to three and make it one to six. For every six full points of strength add one to the base Damage value of the melee attack. This puts a strength 12 character at the low end of machine gun damage and the same character using a combat axe doing the damage of a Panther Assault Cannon. Which is still insane but you get at least something for being that focused on strength.

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  #73  
Old Dec 14th, 2021, 10:30 PM
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I didn't realize that adding STR to melee weapon damage would make melee OP over heavy weapons.

...I guess I can see how that would be a bad thing.

In the end, I like your suggestion of +1 damage/6 STR. Trolls and orcs with their special stats can probably reach 6 STR no problem while maintaining a high Agility for the melee dice pool during character creation.

I personally have yet to get into a real combat in SR6e and still need to get a feel for it. <shrug>
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Last edited by Silk; Dec 14th, 2021 at 10:33 PM.
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  #74  
Old Dec 14th, 2021, 10:45 PM
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Having studied martial arts for many decades, I know that a strike to the right location can be just as devastating as a bullet and in some cases can even cause death more efficiently than a random shot.

With a sharp sword and a skilled attacker, a melee weapon could cause more damage than a single shot from even a high caliber firearm.

I can see a strong argument about making melee attacks stronger, even if they surpass a heavy weapon because the range weapon will have the distinct advantage of, well, range where a melee fighter has to cross the distance to reach their target. In the open, even a low powered firearm will take down the best martial artist before they can reach them. Despite all the debates about different calibers, even a 22 (which is one of the smallest calibers) can still be lethal in the right hands and a lucky shot (and yes, I also have experience with firearms and go to a range on a regular basis).

So, I am open to whatever the group wants to do because whatever rules we come up with for the players will also apply to the NPCs, so it will balance out either way.
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  #75  
Old Dec 14th, 2021, 11:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenjitsu View Post
Having studied martial arts for many decades, I know that a strike to the right location can be just as devastating as a bullet and in some cases can even cause death more efficiently than a random shot.

With a sharp sword and a skilled attacker, a melee weapon could cause more damage than a single shot from even a high caliber firearm.

I can see a strong argument about making melee attacks stronger, even if they surpass a heavy weapon because the range weapon will have the distinct advantage of, well, range where a melee fighter has to cross the distance to reach their target. In the open, even a low powered firearm will take down the best martial artist before they can reach them. Despite all the debates about different calibers, even a 22 (which is one of the smallest calibers) can still be lethal in the right hands and a lucky shot (and yes, I also have experience with firearms and go to a range on a regular basis).

So, I am open to whatever the group wants to do because whatever rules we come up with for the players will also apply to the NPCs, so it will balance out either way.
Realistically yes but most games including SR are not simulationist in nature. Those games that are tend to be brutal and character death happens quite often. 6e most guns on base damage won't do that but the moment you add in net hits then you start having character death potentially quite frequently.

This tends to promote builds or paths toward focusing on Body and Edge.

It also depends on if you are looking at the original Assault Cannons, they're meant to take down buildings and given they are Sci-Fi based their damage factor is vastly more massive than any melee weapon and this was the case through all editions until 6e.

Right now in 6e, especially since most fights will take place at short range those melee specialists will close and may have only one wound to show for it.
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