[OOC] The Tea Shop

[Frogman]

@FFFFFF: I'm waiting until I get a response to those die rolls before I go ahead and do anything with those fishermen.

[FFFFFF]

The results depend somewhat on what you're hoping for. You had a quite good Knowledge (Local) check and probably know whatever you'd like to know. Your Sense Motive would fail to discern anything - unless you're trying to figure out that Goda is drunk. Your Perception is good enough to see the fishermen clearly, but not make out any particularly fine details.

p.s. - at the end of this game week, players will role for resources to see how many GP they get to spend on their area of authority (including their own salary) for the coming month, and I'll allocate XP. As well, we'll be playing the first round of Kingmaker, as it were. The plots we're wrapping up before the end of the week are: Shin in Shanghai, Yongyu and the fishermen, Katsutoshi and the giant, and Ran and the queen.

[Frogman]

Well I was trying to figure out if the fishermen were dressed/acting in a way that would make sense for local fishermen.

[FFFFFF]

They are absolutely dressed like local fishermen - and you've probably seen fishermen haul sampans onto shore to repair them. You've never seen anyone bury one before, that is pretty weird.

[Allu]

Hmm, that Hungarian is a long way from home.

[FFFFFF]

Yeah, it was hard for me to guess how long it would take for a giant to walk from Hungary to southeast Asia, foraging and resting along the way... I hope 2 years isn't a vast under-estimate.

Allu/Shin - I can't quite bring you home until I resolve the scene with Frogman/Yongyu, GMD/Ran, and the Queen, which is probably after one more post from each of them.

Grundz/Katsutoshi - same deal, you and Bale will be coming home the same time as Shin, back with Captain Tang. It could be a very long time before a ship shows up off the coast of Ningde, and it only delays him by a week to take you back. As to what Bale can teach you, and any other individual who spends a week with him (he can't teach a whole classroom at a time) - he can teach Magyar, but he knows less about Christianity than you do. He doesn't speak Greek and would never have read a Bible, whereas you have at least reviewed excerpts from one in translation in Zhonghua critical texts, and maybe even flipped through a smuggled copy. He can tell you anecdotes about Christianity as its practiced, and the idiomatic differences of Magyar practice. As to the Woodcraft bonus, he can grant anyone who spends a week with him Track, the Ranger ability, along with Favored Enemy: Lycanthrope. It'd take a week of days spent with him, but he could teach any NPC or PC these techniques.

Or... when you examine the sword with Spellcraft, you find it is a +2 alchemical silver Lycanthrope Bane longsword.

[FFFFFF]

I hate to say it but I feel like this game has died. It is largely my fault for letting people split up but still trying to tell plots that involve multiple characters.

Sorry guys! I appreciate everyone working with me and giving me a shot on my first game. I may give Kingmaker another shot again, but in the mean-while I just posted an advertisement for a game I think ought to be simple and fun... anyone from this game who would like to join, you are unconditionally accepted, and I'd be very happy to game with you again.

[Frogman]

Wait really? I thought we were still making progress.

[Allu]

So did I for that matter.

[FFFFFF]

Hrm. I hate to say it, but the plot is in a situation where I need four active players. I'm sorry I let things get convoluted.

That said - I have been thinking about running a kingdom vs. kingdom Kingmaker game that I would need co-DMs for. Would either of you be interested?

My idea is two frontier towns out in the middle of nowhere fighting over the scarce resources of... a dusty plateau with valuable minerals in it? The towns would be seeded by warring nationalities, say Cheliax vs. Kelesh. Technically at war, but out there, thousands of miles away from the ministers of war, who is to say a tense detente couldn't exist?

The biggest problem with the Kingmaker system is creating dozens of unique, opinionated NPCs to fill the Leadership Roles. That is a real headache. Yet, we're not going to attract (or be able to manage if we did) 24 players to fill the roles. Any ideas on how to simplify/condense the Leadership Role system?

The second biggest problem is the tension between micro and macro time-scales. The Kingmaker system measures things on a month-to-month basis, and I want it to be the core of the game... but players generally want to do things on a day-to-day basis, individually ensuring the success of each of their goals... and there is no good reason to tell them not to, other than "gee, I was hoping to get a month's worth of actions out of the way this week". I'd really like to do at least a month of game time per week of real time.

My biggest point-of-concern is that the game should be able to continue with just one active player on each side. I'm thinking of how to represent that narratively and within the rules. A sort of 'City Council' where whoever has time to vote on the relevant issues within a week are the de facto rulers for the week, and not get hung up on titles and areas-of-concern like I did in this game - it was cool, and fun, but it is also a big part of why the game got so convoluted. In fact, I think the ultimate solution to the #1 problem is to do away with the Leadership Roles entirely and just have every PC grant their highest attribute as a bonus to their kingdom.

Other themes: Dealing with the natives; I like the idea of stealing a quasi-Aztec Lizardfolk culture from the Warhammer roleplaying game. Spaghetti-western narratives; I definitely want 'gold rush', and 'hang 'em high' cultural influences.

Interested? Any thoughts? If so, I think this as good of a place to hash this all out as any.

[Allu]

I had much the same problem when I was trying to run my dawn of civilisation problem, you want to roleplay but you also want to get things done on the macro scale, my idea was pretty much give them a succint scene a week (an in game month) and they have to do something, deal with an unruly courtier or go and deal with some natives. Now they might not get all the way through it but they would get bonuses to their action for the month based on their dealing with that roleplay scene.

I think you might have to just advertise for two players (or have a few more factions, dwarves maybe?) and have them fill the role of leader. Cheliax and Kelesh both are pretty much dictatorships so they would be able to order everyone around (whether or not their orders are followed is another thing).
Basically you would roll up ONE courtier and then arrange the stats according to role for each of the NPCs and then only develop their personalities as needed. That or just do what you said and modify the DCs accordingly.

[Frogman]

Why make things this complicated to begin with? If you want the game to reflect the growth of a civilization you don't need to run the civ as a player or as a bunch of NPCs. Set up a series of milestones like "builds first defensive wall" and "begins exporting ore" or "finds good water source". Have the PCs be involved in some of the milestones like they went out to scout for water or they have to defend the wall builders. Always have multiple milestones going at the same time. There's no reason to introduce mechanics into this when you can just do it by building a decent "ecosystem of powers" and storytelling.

[FFFFFF]

Allu - I like that idea of having each city-state be ran by a single PC. I think you'd definitely want more than just two city-states then.

Frog - I may need a better example of what you mean? If I'm understanding you right, it sounds pretty linear. I think I'd rather run something more sandbox-like, where the players have a lot of problems on their plates and they get to imagine their own solutions.

[Frogman]

No it's not necessarily a linear progression. When you build a faction you set up a bunch of long term goals that the faction would logically have and then imagine ways that the factions would meet those goals.
Since you're going to have like what 5 factions with tons of goals progressing to meet those goals simultaneously it's really more a matter of managing story threads, balancing powers and the like. The role of a player in this environment is whatever they want it to be and their actions naturally have impacts on the factions, helping, hindering or neutral. It's not about railroading it's building a setting and letting the setting evolve naturally in response to the players.

[FFFFFF]

I put some stuff together - can you guys take a look at it and let me know what you think?